On Politics, We Can Always See the Whites of Their Eyes.
KSM Was Specifically Told He Would Not Die When Waterboarded
by: Bill Dupray posted: 2009-04-26 17:34:00
Viewed 1480 times. 11 Comments.
And that, under U.S. law, means it was not torture.
From The Corner.
According to the International Red Cross documents that were recently released, which quote KSM and other detainees describing their interrogations, KSM says he told by his interrogators that he would not die. With the release of the OLC memos, we know why: one of the red lines that, if crossed, would have made the techniques torture under US law was whether the detainees thought they were in danger of death. That is why they were told specifically they would not die.
Hell, they tell you you might die when you go in to have your appendix taken out.
Doctors might want to brace themselves for coming Congressional Hearings on their torture practices.
Tags: Torture,
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Comments 11
Wasn't one of the arguments against Sean Hannity subjecting himself to Water Boarding being that it wouldn't be torture because he knows he won't drown and he won't die?
Doesn't this information blow these arguments out of the water?
Paging Sean...
Smile ...
It's tough to develop a cogent argument that will stand up over time when one makes it up as one goes along.
Are you seriously saying that if it does not kill you, it is not torture? I can do anything I want to someone, and if I don't kill them then I did not torture them? Really???
It is apparently what the law says as to this specific issue. Opinion has got nothing to do with it.
It looks like the article says "one of the red lines that, if crossed, would have made the techniques torture under US law..." It would be interesting to know what the other red lines are.
That's not at all what he's saying. Whether or not something is considered torture under law lies in the perception of the person subject to the interrogation. A person is being is tortured if he believes that the technique could result in his death. If a person knows that he is not going to die, then it's not torture. If you can't see the difference between undergoing an unpleasant experience (even a very unpleasant experience) that you know won't kill you and one that you think might, then I think you need to look a little harder.
I'm not sure that I agree with your "perception" statement. The US Code defines tortures in this way: (2) “severe mental pain or suffering” means the prolonged mental harm caused by or resulting from—
(A) the intentional infliction or threatened infliction of severe physical pain or suffering;
(B) the administration or application, or threatened administration or application, of mind-altering substances or other procedures calculated to disrupt profoundly the senses or the personality;
(C) the threat of imminent death; or
(D) the threat that another person will imminently be subjected to death, severe physical pain or suffering, or the administration or application of mind-altering substances or other procedures calculated to disrupt profoundly the senses or personality;
That seems to be a factual basis rather than a perception basis. I understand the perception basis - pointing an empty gun at a person is criminally the same as pointing a loaded gun. The law looks to the perception of the victim rather than the factual ability of the actor.
On the perception angle, what if someone was "deathly afraid" of insects? The standard would be so flexible as to be unenforceable.
I did a post on the law with links here - http://patriotroom.com/article/torture-defined
Are these people CRAZY? Do you realize how many American lives have been saved by interrogating prisoners of war. YES, when you in a battle zone and you capture them while they are trying to kill you or have you killed THAT IS a prisoner of war. How many activists in thier country do you think there are saying "Please don't behead those prisoner. Please don't blow up innocent people by being a suicide bomber.
Are you Really that Ignorant? Do you have wait for them to break down your door and drag you into the street before you open your eyes and your mind? Believe me, the this country's world stature and reputation is being beaten down by your president and his cronies that scenerio is not out of the realm of possibilies.
If some were trying to kill a member of your family would stand by and contemplate his rights? For the sake of your loved ones, I hope you never have to decide.
I don't know if you can enter two comments, but I will try to keep this short.
Since the Revolutionary War countless men and women have fought, have died and yes some have been tortured in order to give you freedom and to provide you with a degree of safety.
Do you think it is by chance that we have not fought wars in our back yards since the Civil War? NO, it is because of the dedication of men and women who answered a call to duty and defended you and your family’s freedoms and to keep our enemies out of our "yard". Have we had any major incidents since 9-11? That's because they knew we were willing to react quickly and decisively rather than call a meeting to address their rights.
I recall an early news story of a Marine hitting a prisoner he had just captured. The reporter belittled him and talked of his cruelty. The reporter failed to mention that just minutes before he came along that the prisoner was trying to blow the Marines head off.
What would you do?
Don't forget or disrespect the sacrifices of the Patriots who accepted the challenge to protect YOU and don't be critical of their efforts if you have not walked in their shoes.
Tony, you can enter as many comments as you want to. It isn't spamming if you're contributing. Thanks for taking the time to write.
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If i was in charge, I would take a tweezers and pluck KSM's ass hair out , hair by hair.